Wednesday, August 10, 2011

First Ever Non-Governmental TFR Issued over Lee Bottom Flying Field

Some things in life just get under your skin and gnaw at you.  If you're a pilot, TFRs are likely one of those things.
The recent intercept of a 75 year old lady out enjoying the freedom of flight in her Cub is the latest point of contention. It places firmly in my “will not roll off my back” list.
Tooling along enjoying a beautiful day in her Cub, Myrtle Rose (now is that name from the greatest generation or what) was enjoying the fruits of life when out of nowhere two nice gentlemen flew along side to admire her seventy-some year old plane, or at least that’s what she thought. In fact though, she was being intercepted by highly capable F-16 pilots (like the one that went off the runway in Oshkosh) because she had allegedly pierced a 30 mile Presidential TFR.
Whatever happened, let’s be honest.  There is nothing Presidential about the Presidential TFR. This outlandish regulation restricts the freedom of citizens and with each passing year makes many of them criminals in the eyes of the government. It implies King status to the President while treating citizens like subjects. And worse, it conveys, somewhat redundantly to King Status, that the country could not survive the death of a President. But that simply is not true.
Were Air Force One and Two both to go down simultaneously full of Congressman right on up to the President, our country would come out the other side whole. The death of any President would not bring collapse nor would it bring anything but a short term change to the stock market. Yes, it would very emotional and dramatic but I believe it would ultimately reveal a country immensely capable of surviving such a perceived calamity. But that is the biggest fear of anyone in D.C. The inability to survive without your dear leader is inferred in every Presidential TFR and sadly many have bought into it. Yet behind every Presidential TFR, there is nothing more than politics and self-absorption.
My friends, the time has come for citizens to claim their proper place in the sun out from under the shadow of politics, the title of terrorist, and baseless regulations like that of the TFR. And, in doing my part, I am going to take the first daring step for everyone. On Sunday, August 14th, at 7 AM EST, Lee Bottom Flying Field will issue the first ever Non-Governmental TFR; from this point on to be known as a "Myrtle Rose TFR".
Measured outward in all directions from the center-point of Lee Bottom Flying Field, with a radius of fifteen miles, once in effect any and all unknown or unfamiliar government equipment or representatives will be restricted from entrance. Any such unknown or unfamiliar government equipment or representatives attempting to enter Myrtle Rose TFR #00001 will be perceived as a an extreme terrorist threat and treated as such.  Furthermore, government representatives operating in the area who are not approved to enter this TFR should review the NORAD rules for interception.  Pilots being joined unexpectedly by two vintage taildraggers should assume they have strayed into Myrtle Rose Airspace and that they and their dirt stained F-16s will be escorted out of the area.

NGC Number                                               #00001
Issue Date -    August 9, 2011 at 11:00 UTC
Location-    HANOVER, Indiana near NABB VORTAC (ABB)
Beginning Date and Time -    Effective August 14, 2011 11:00 UTC
Ending Date and Time -    August 15, 2011 11:00 UTC

Reason for NOTAM                 
Type -    Large Gathering of GA Pilots and Aircraft
Replaced NOTAM(s) -    N/A
Pilots May Contact -    HANOVER Center, 812-866-3211
Location -    On NABB VOR (ABB) 085 degree radial at 10.2  nautical miles.
Radius -    15 nautical miles
Altitude -    From the surface up to and including 5000 feet MSL

Unknown Government Employees and Equipment may not operate in this airspace
ARTCC -    LBA Hanover Zone
Point of Contact -    Free Flight Association
Telephone -     812-866-3211
Frequency -     122.9
Authority -    Title 14 LBFR section 91.137(a)(2)(sub-section UY)
Governing Body -    C.A.B.


Rich Davidson said...

Crank Too, you sound suspiciously like a good friend of mine. The only difference is that he knows he could put his name to his posts and I would not be offended but instead would enjoy the debate.
Well, I take that back. If the government was capable of actual sex, he would not have sexual relations with them as it seems you would. When the system no longer follows the system (the rules laid down by our founders), then it is they who are operating illegally. Anyway, I would love to continue the debate but I do not allow anonymous posts. Please put your name to the post next time or it will be removed.

Rich Davidson said...

As for throwing friends under the bus, it is hard for everyone to be faced with reality. Even myself. I willingly admit that. But you left out the fact that they believe the same things but just refuse to do or say anything about it. Many farmers know subsidies are wrong but they say nothign because they get easy money from the program. Pilots hate what their groups are doing but say nothing because an influential friend sits on the board and they do not want to be negatively effected by pointing out their group is not doing a good job. This is a real problem and it pervades every level of our society today. It is also wrong. Friend or not, it is wrong and I hope if I am doing something similar, they will let me know. My friends are a vaired group that I think highly of but I will not sit by and have someone tell me to take it easy just because my saying something makes them feel uncomfortable about not doing anything. If you want the apple cart upset, don't get ruffled when someone starts doing so.

Crank Too said...

I don't blame you from removing my comments, and I take that as a personal victory. Have fun in your small and bitter world. Out.

Charlie W said...

Hey, Rich,
Do I need clearance if I keep it under 100kts?
Looking forward to sharing those fresh peaches!

Charlie Dean

Rich Davidson said...

Sir, if you believe refusing the opportunity to post any comments and have them stay here for all to see simply by stating your name is a victory, then that tells me all I need to know. There is one rule nearly every blog on the planet has. You cannot attack and run away without at least being man or woman enough to put your name to it. That is no victory, that is pathetic.

Fred Larson said...

Even if you believe in the purpose of a VIP TFR, the problem is they are ineffective to accomplish same. Anyone actually bent on going after the VIP by air (i.e. in a bomb-laden GA aircraft) could be on the ground before the NORAD jets could do anything about it (although it would probably require something faster than a Cub).

Roy Fox said...

Rich, did not Mark Twain say that
"no ones life life liberty or property is safe whilst the Government is in session"

Roy Fox,


Rich Davidson said...

Roy, I believe you are correct. Mr. Twain was a very observant man.
By the way, we look forward to seeing you here next month.

Dan vdMeer said...

I appreciate the humor in this poke in the eye to TFRS, but I can't really work up much sympathy for Ms. Rose.
- No pilot, particularly one flying NORDO in and around a Class B area should fail to check NOTAMs
- The media loves this kind of story. It suggests that GA pilots can jump in any aircraft and fly anywhere, any time. It suggests that we just dont care about safety.
- The hard-line, pro-regulation, eliminate any terrorist risk, shut down more air space, suits use these kinds of events to justify bigger and more aggressive TFRs and even more limited access to airports and security.
- Folks who want to make it more difficult for older aviators to retain their certificates see this as a semi-demented old fool flying around in an antique with no radios and endangering the public. And when this "old fool" is confronted by the Air Force, she shrugs it off as some kind of encounter with a couple of cowboy jet jocks who have nothing better to do than check out her cute airplane.
- This may have been Ms Rose's last flight as PIC. Busting a Presidential or other VIP TFR gets their ticket suspended or worse. -This is not a small matter, particularly given the circumstances- A Presidential TFR, Chicago air space, didn't understand the intercept procedures, national media coverage. Yikes!
- Think about how this aircraft was identified. I'll bet she wasn't picked up by the Tracon, even tho they have the ability to spot a primary target. We are all being watched in and around protected airspace via satellite. Any aircraft busting a TFR or lingering around a nuclear plant or any sensitive air space is under surveillance.
This rant is not intended as an argument for the TFR system. I dont much like it. But we have to live with it and respect its ability to bite us in the butt as individuals and limit our freedoms to fly even more than now. We need to be a bit more unforgiving of pilots who screw thing up for the rest of us and a little less hostile to those who dont share our political beliefs.
Thanks for your support of vintage aviation and the opportunity to disagree politely
Dan VanderMeer
St Pete, FL
C159G and Champ 7AC

Rich Davidson said...

Dan, I agree with much of what you say. But, we do not have to live with it. It is, after all, our government. TFRs are baseless and with enough people kicking and screaming it can be changed. Apathy will get us nothing. Furthermore, Myrtle's issue is a much better slight on the system that it is on a pilot that didn't follow rules that are nearly impossible to follow faithfully. That is why they are set up that way. To discourage flight all together.

Anonymous said...

Those who desire to give up freedom in order to gain security will not have, nor do they deserve, either one.
-- President Thomas Jefferson. 1743-1826

snaproll said...

The USAF manages to find a litle ofd lady in a J3 cub.
But where the heck were they on Sept 11, 2001?
Can someone with a straight face tell me the USAF did not have the planes, the know-how or the manpower to intercept 4 airliners in the NE corridor in 2001? Please!
--Adam Shaw
Wingman CAPTENS Formation Aerobatic Display team

PS: lost oldest friend in the world on AA flight into WTC .

TheLazyC said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
TheLazyC said...

You know, if we were the bad guys, thanks to our Government, we know exactly where the President and other officals are days in advance.

If they did not put out the TFRs, then we would only know that the President visited XXX when we watched the news.

When the President travels it disrupts everything. The last time he was close, they closed down most of the city, blocked roads, etc., just so he could visit storm damage.

We don't need TFRs for Political figures, we need TFRs when I fly!

Ken Currin
South Hill, VA

Pops said...

I love your sense of humor and agree in principle with your reasoning regarding Presidential protection. Being a Crew Chief of one of those "dirt stained F-16's" in your very own state I might add the following rebuttal.

Those F-16's are actually stained with oil and hydraulic fluid from yankin and bankin at 9 G's four to six hours every day. Because of that they dont sit long enough to be wiped down twice a day like some precious pampered Oskosh show winning ragwing that spend it's life in a protected environment except for the two hours a month that it's flying.

MSgt Dave Chamberlin
181st FW (formerly)
122nd FW (current)

Ken Calman said...

From the bottom of my heart, THANK YOU, LBFF, for you have fulfilled a wish of my very own. Having seen all these iditoic TFRs popping up for the so-called protection of those big hats that tend to drop in here and there to show us how the Better Half live, it has begun to annoy me too, and my wish was that We, the People, should issue TFRs when we want to just to keep the Big Hats and their toadies out. You have done it for me, exactly according to my wishes. THANK YOU my common-sense friends!

Ken Calman
Glendale, AZ

krhea said...

Go for it yu got my support!!!

Rich Davidson said...

MSgt DAve, I couldn't agree more. Nothing worse than a wonderful old ragwing sitting in a hangar. Of course more of them now do so because of things like TFRs restricting flight to the point it is no fun. I'd rather your oil and hydraulic fluid be dripping from altitude onto the dead corpse of a real enemy overseas...and I'm sure you feel the same.

Ken said...

LMAO Rich!
You did it again!
Thanks for making me laugh during these otherwise insane times!
"Presidential TFR" my a**!
See you next month!
Ken Bittner

Ken said...

You might be interested in this;

Good hunting!
Ken Bittner

wjdavid said...

Rich, What a great idea, a TFR over L/B. The only thing I don’t like about it is that it wasn’t my idea. I always like to take credit for the good stuff and pin the bad stuff on somebody else. Guess I should have been a politician.
TFR’s are like many things we have been doing in the so called war on terrorism, stupid. In order to keep the conversation organized and coherent I will attempt to keep it focused on one aspect of what the TFR is supposed to do, shoot down a terrorist. If I understand it correctly the TFR is in place to protect the President from being attacked from the air. Disregarding the fact that the chances of dispatching a fighter, locating, and identifying an aircraft in such a short period of time and then shooting it down are just about impossible, especially if it is a big old jet airliner, the question I have is where will the stricken aircraft fall?
This is the part that bothers me second of all. Hopefully it would fall in a field in the middle of nowhere and that would be the end of it. But what if it fell on your house and killed your child? Would it be worth the loss to gain the edge on the so called war on terrorism? Would an edge be gained? Would the fighter pilot that holds his or her finger on the trigger really go through with it knowing that it just might fall on the proverbial school yard? Would the country be better off with collateral civilian death in order to save a President? I don’t have to think twice for my answer and I bet I know what your’s would be Rich, and that brings me to what scares me most of all, most people would say yes.
In spite of the fact that all of the interceptions performed since the hysteria began, all of the aircraft intercepted have been civilian. In spite of the fact that there have been thousand of penetrations of restricted airspace over The White House by airline pilots flying airliners with hundreds of passengers onboard, in spite of the fact that Phil Boyer and his wife went for a ride one day and were forced down by the government because they penetrated the ADIZ around D.C. when their fancy transponder later proved they did not, in spite of many facts like these, the American people are still in favor of this nonsense.
Now the average citizen would say that an accidental shoot down could never occur, that there is technology to prevent that from happening. If that average citizen would take the time to research history that he probably lived through and forgot about, he would learn that may not be the case. I recall an incident where an aircraft carrier named the USS Vincennes shot down what they thought was an attacking F-15 when in reality it was a climbing airliner with 290 souls onboard. If a person uses their head (something that is not encouraged nowadays) and thinks about this a bit, it wasn’t a cruise ship on holiday shooting off fireworks for fun. This was a ship full of hundreds of trained, experienced professional, well equipped soldiers that were aware of their mission utilizing the best technology available, and they still shot down the wrong airplane. Of course that couldn’t happen here.

wjdavid said...

2 of 2
The average guy would say, “ yea, but they got a lot better stuff to do that now,” and I would agree, but it didn’t stop the CIA from screwing up a few years ago and being
party to shooting down and killing a missionaries’ wife and child because they thought they were drug smugglers. To me that is bad enough but what is worse the government got caught trying to cover it up. How many people are aware of these two incidents? They are recent history.
If one looks at the facts rather than listening to the truth, I believe that given our rather dismal track record the potential for a screwed up shoot down is highly probable. If we ever go so far as to pull the trigger innocent people will most likely have to die regardless of whether the errant airplane is, or is not a, “terrorist.” Will this be worth saving a Presidents life?
The bad news for me is most people in this country would rather hear the truth than examine the facts. Politicians and bureaucrats give us their version of the truth they think we want to hear and we are buying it by the truck load. I am afraid that persecution of pilots by imposing government restrictions on our ability to exercise the freedom of flight that many fought for and died for, is slowing slipping away. We are the only country in the world that offers an average citizen an opportunity to enjoy the freedom of flight, and we are losing it one TFR at a time. If you don’t think so just try to walk into the FBO at you local airport, if they are still in business, and try to rent an airplane. Good luck.
I hope your issuance of the Rose TFR sparks a debate on the subject, but I am sorry to say that I don’t think that it will. I think that we are like sheep doing what we are told, myself included. TFRs are stupid, they do nothing to make anyone or anything secure from attack, that is a fact, but like everybody else, I accept them, I take my shoes off, I carry less than three ounces of fluid, and I let them take naked pictures of my daughter while they feel my wife’s breasts. After all, it’s all for the war on terrorism isn’t it?

Pops said...

Just a few responses here:

1. Yes I would rather my jet be used to put holes in bad guys rather than intercepting light GA aircraft. This shouldnt be a problem in the future since we've converted to A-10 Warthogs. It would actually be more suited to GA interception since you could flip the bad guy out if the air with just the gun blast.

2. Let's just say some terrorist did manage to fly an explosives laden Tri Pacer into a Presidential birthday party. Don't you think the general public as well as the government would be screaming about "where was our Air Force"? You'll never make everyone happy.

3. As to the question about where was our Air Force on 9-11 I would just say this. Our mission was never really to protect against this sort of threat. Before 9-11 we didn't have fighters sitting Alert all over the country and armed with live weapons. Thank the end of the Cold War and the various BRAC's for that. Even the jets we have in the air may not be armed depending on the mission. Then there's the delay of just trying to make sense of the attack and then react to it. And nobody understood we were under attack until the 2nd jet hit the WTC. It left very little time to react to the other two attacks. I will say that there were jets enroute and supersonic over OH and PA. Funny sidenote: when they made sonic booms over Dayton OH there happened to be a grass fire going on at the VA and the news media reported that the VA center was under attack.

Now don't get me wrong - I thought it was irresponsible when Clinton caused huge delays in the whole ATC system just so he could get a haircut on the runway in LA.

Quite frankly I dont think a J3 could carry enough explosives to blow up the Presidents dog. Not putting down J3's but let's be realistic.

Of course our dear little old lady could have just as easily missed the NOTAM regarding a closure of an MOA and gotten herself killed. And possibly others operating in the area. It's happened before. The real issue here is that she broke one of the regs of her pilots certificate. Plain and simple.

MSgt Dave Chamberlin